ARB Front Locker Update.

Joined: 26 Oct 2002 Location: Melbourne

OK guys we have to start seriously lobbying now.
I spoke to Greg Milton at ARB head office here in Melbourne and he said they have done a great deal of work already.
They have confirmed (as per my email to him) that one part no will cover a big range of Pajero front diffs also Challengers and Tritons.
They have had 2 front diffs apart and engineering/technically it is a straight foward development.
They are baulking at the old potential sales issue. Pajero rear airlockers only represent 1.1% of total locker sales and this is why they didn't develop one for the 3.5 V6. They also got burnt on the the Jackeroo/Trooper front airlocker. It costs them $150-200K to develop a locker from scratch and they have to be sure they will get their $ back.
They are in the process of market research to assess potential sales so we have to shout loud !!!
He also said the company who makes the factory lockers for Mitsu in Japan have breached copyrite.
Email Greg Milton at sales@arb.com.au
and let them know your interest.
This may very well tip the balance in our favour. He said a decision will be made in the next few weeks so time is short. If they go ahead it takes around 6 or so months to have all the development and tooling done to go into production and sell to the public.

Joined: 02 Jan 2003

Sent my email. I would get one, as it allows me to keep my constant 4WD.

Also posted it to aus.cars.offroad.

Joined: 15 Jan 2003 Location: Sth Gippy

Registered my interest also. Pointed out that most later Paj's have LSD rear, so I want the drive/pull up front.

What's the connection with Jackeroo/Troopy front diffs?

Neil

Joined: 26 Oct 2002 Location: Melbourne

Well the Jackeroo guys (Troopers in the US) on Trail Talk got together 50 deposits of $200 Ea and lobbied ARB USA to pressure ARB head office here in Melbourne to develop a front air locker (there already was a rear available). They somehow agreed to it and the locker was produced, they have sold very few above those 50. I pointed out that they will sell at least 5X more for Paj's but they are still sceptical and want to see the interest. I don't think they will let that happen again.

Joined: 26 Nov 2002 Location: Nannup, Western Australia

Bitsamissin wrote:

Well the Jackeroo guys (Troopers in the US) on Trail Talk got together 50 deposits of $200 Ea and lobbied ARB USA to pressure ARB head office here in Melbourne to develop a front air locker (there already was a rear available). They somehow agreed to it and the locker was produced, they have sold very few above those 50. I pointed out that they will sell at least 5X more for Paj's but they are still sceptical and want to see the interest. I don't think they will let that happen again.

Guess I'd better get one before they sell out... :wink:

Noel

Joined: 06 Jan 2003 Location: Phoenix, AZ USA

I sent an e-mail, along with some photos of recvent club activity. If infact, deposits are required, or will help get this prgram rolling, just let us know.
Thanks, Paul

Joined: 03 Jan 2003 Location: USA

I can assure you that they will want deposits. It is how many they want that is going to make or break us.

Joined: 26 Oct 2002 Location: Melbourne

No they will not require any deposits. They will never do that again, the Trooper/Jackeroo front locker really burnt them and is making them extra cautious about the Paj one.
He told me they will be making the decision to go ahead or not based on market research (not deposits) thats why it's important to show our interest. They will be making the decision at head office to go into production or not, if so they will be just available for purchase like any other locker when they are ready.
Reading between the lines they were suckered into the Trooper lockers by intense pressure from ARB USA (50 deposits) without really looking into other markets/sales. They are very wary of that now.

Joined: 14 Jan 2003 Location: Albuquerque New Mexico

Since Isuzu 4x4s outsell Mits by 100s to 1 in the US, there is certainly no market in the US, maybe 20-30 units ever. The SCARY thing is the US IS the biggest locker market in the world! So there is no doubt the market is far worse, then Isuzu. Back in the old club days I desperately tried to get the few active Montero owners in the US together, becuase companys like ARB pay close attention to these gatherings as a sign of market. Isuzu can gather 100 vehicles several times a year, we got up to 13 once then dropped to 2-3. Finally had 20 or so interested rigs one year and had arranged for an ARB rep to ride with us, but did not contact him at the last minute becuase everyone canceled except 3 vehicles. I bet they dont sell more then 2-3 rear lockers/ year for Monteros, can you emagine how many front ones they could sell? Lets face it, front lockers are only for hardcore extreme wheelers, and there are less then a dozen wheeling Monteros in the US, compared to hundreds and thousands for other makes. I hate to be negative, but I am just being brutaly honest. If you are hardcore enough to need a front locker, then sacrificing on road snow driving capability is the least of your concerns for that rig, and Detroits can be bribed into production, despite dismal profits for the makers.

Joined: 26 Oct 2002 Location: Melbourne

Yes but you guys got the 3.5 V6 with the factory locker we didn't (there are some around but very rare) we did get the 3.0 V6 locker as a factory option though. This leaves the 3.5 guys with no options other than the Detroit but most don't want to loose the super select function.
We estimate there are around 50+ Detroits here with another 30 being made right now, no other country to my knowledge makes these for the Mitsi.
Aki in Japan says there is big interest over there with the two clubs (about 350 members combined) they only have factory lockers or the ARB 3.0 V6 rear.
I believe the biggest markets are here in Oz as the Gen 3 3.2 GDI is selling very well and in Japan with various other sales made up from the US and Europe.
It's more effective to put an airlocker in the front (particularly with IFS) combined with the rear lsd (which works reasonably well) as opposed to just a rear locker.
I'll have my front Detroit soon as I'm not concerned about the super select or snow driving but would prefer an airlocker though for versatility.

Joined: 15 Jan 2003 Location: Sth Gippy

Bitsamissin.
Sorry! Thoght Trooper meant "troopy" and assumed cruiser. Could not put it together!

Swartzy, what are you on about? Are you tring to tell us that only hardcore guys get stuck?

Joined: 03 Jan 2003 Location: USA

Neilj wrote:

Swartzy, what are you on about? Are you trying to tell us that only hardcore guys get stuck?

No he is trying to say that only 5% of the montero owners that wheel in the US have lockers. And that although 95% will say they want a front locker, the market is unfortunately alot smaller.

Joined: 14 Jan 2003 Location: Albuquerque New Mexico

Neilj wrote:

Bitsamissin.
Sorry! Thoght Trooper meant "troopy" and assumed cruiser. Could not put it together!

Swartzy, what are you on about? Are you tring to tell us that only hardcore guys get stuck?

No, its just a front locker is an extremely hardcore mod. Lets face it, 33s and a rear locker will take care of ANY difficult trail. Sure, my front Detroit provides for fun side " extras", and optional insane lines, but its really only needed for hardcore, extreme trails. In the US no one wheels those kind of trails in a Montero except me, or with me for the most part.(a few exceptions asside) When you see a list of interested front locker guys, most dont even have a rear locker yet! makes you wonder! Just trying to be honest about the US market potential ,its brutal considering fourwheeling has been re-invented in the US, but Frank can tell you....

Joined: 15 Jan 2003 Location: Sth Gippy

Sorry mate. Misunderstood.

Neil

Joined: 08 Feb 2003 Location: Queensland, Australia

Does anyone know what Diffs are fitted to my Delica (model PE8W).

Joined: 26 Oct 2002 Location: Melbourne

Being a 2.8tdi you should have the super select front 8" diff (if ARB goes ahead it will fit your front diff). The rear will probly be the 10" with the 4.90:1 ratio (no aftermarket locker available unless it came optioned from the factory).

Joined: 08 Feb 2003 Location: Queensland, Australia

Thanks for the information, it's optioned with a LSD in the rear, I hope ARB goes ahead. there might be some Delica owners out there interested as well.

Joined: 16 Dec 2002 Location: Neither here nor there

Being ignorant to most things Mitsubishi, I hadn't actually seen or heard of a Delica until the other day when i saw one on the road.
My first impression was that it looked like it had an awfully high centre of gravity. Are they just new L300's? (is that what they were called?) I've seen a few of these go over. Twisted Evil

If this is the case, why would you want a front locker on something that is essentially a 4WD mini-van??
Wouldn't it make more sense to get something more suitable for diff lock required terrain?
I'm not trying to rubbish Mitsubishi's, just curious? Question

Joined: 26 Oct 2002 Location: Melbourne

Yes they are a new L300 so to speak and a grey import.
You should see the body lifts the Japs put in over there, anything up to 4" and they look absolutely dangerous to me. But thankfully they do it for show (mall cruisers).
I did see a L300 in the High Country a few years back (big lift, 32" muddies) and it surprised me where it went and the bloke had his whole family in it and seemed to be enjoying himself. So who knows.............