Simpson desert this September

Joined: 20 Sep 2004 Location: the vegas

Hey kids,
I haven't been active on these forums for years due to not having a 4by, but here I am again today Very Happy

I'm driving from Brisbane to Alice Springs this September, leaving Brissy about the 12th or so.

I'm borrowing a Mitsubishi Delica for the trip (yah I can hear you sniggering already) and would love to do the Simpson desert from east to west.

Anyone interested in coming with me? Another vehicle would be kind of comforting...

Joined: 04 Jan 2005 Location: Brisbane

Having done the trip, I would never do it by myself.

Too many things can go wrong, and since you area borrowing the car and really dont know it.......

Joined: 20 Sep 2004 Location: the vegas

Chucky wrote:

Having done the trip, I would never do it by myself.

Too many things can go wrong, and since you area borrowing the car and really dont know it.......

Yeah, pretty much my thoughts really. I might go the Plenty Highway if there's no one else around.

Joined: 14 Jan 2007 Location: Melbourne

It gets damn hot in the Simmo in September. Not really a place you want to be taking a vehicle you don't know much about imho.

I just got back from a desert crossing from Dalhousie to Birdsville last week. Our convoy had six vehicles, two sat phones, HF radio and enough spares to practically build another truck.

The only repairs we had to make were a tail light fell out of a GU bumper (fixed with gaffer), a broken UHF ariel mount and two ARB battery craddles busted a weld. No flat tyres which was a surprise.

We came across two other groups with no comms at all. It's no wonder people perish in the desert.

Joined: 20 Sep 2004 Location: the vegas

Cheers mate. I have spent a fair bit of time in the vehicle before, not much of it off road though.

Sat phones are easy enough to hire apparently. My mum actually has a couple of em but they're in Argentina atm.

How hard is the driving? From what I can see it doesn't look that tough, just the endurance factor that's an issue.

Joined: 27 Nov 2002 Location: Lost in Melbourne.

benno_from_brizvegas wrote:

Cheers mate. I have spent a fair bit of time in the vehicle before, not much of it off road though.

Sat phones are easy enough to hire apparently. My mum actually has a couple of em but they're in Argentina atm.

How hard is the driving? From what I can see it doesn't look that tough, just the endurance factor that's an issue.

and many 40+ days in a row... good if you break down... probably as stated, not the best time of year to do it.

Joined: 16 Dec 2004 Location: Up in the clouds

Can I come too I don't take up too much room. Sounds like a awesome trip.

Joined: 20 Sep 2004 Location: the vegas

bogged wrote:

and many 40+ days in a row... good if you break down... probably as stated, not the best time of year to do it.

Would it really get into the 40's in early September? I saw a met report that suggested high 20's which sounds pretty balmy to me.

It doesn't really phase me in terms of comfort or anything (hell, I've ridden a mountain bike through the desert for 600 kms in a Moroccan summer). As long as the car doesn't overheat...

The Plenty Highway certainly makes more sense but it looks shit boring and full of corrugations which are just as likely to rattle the vehicle apart and I'll be . anyway.

Squidly wrote:

Can I come too I don't take up too much room. Sounds like a awesome trip.

I might have a vacancy in the glove box opening up; I'll keep you posted. The Finger

(seriously, if you're not an axe murder some company on the trip would be tops).

Joined: 16 Dec 2004 Location: Up in the clouds

benno_from_brizvegas wrote:

bogged wrote:

and many 40+ days in a row... good if you break down... probably as stated, not the best time of year to do it.

Would it really get into the 40's in early September? I saw a met report that suggested high 20's which sounds pretty balmy to me.

It doesn't really phase me in terms of comfort or anything (hell, I've ridden a mountain bike through the desert for 600 kms in a Moroccan summer). As long as the car doesn't overheat...

The Plenty Highway certainly makes more sense but it looks shit boring and full of corrugations which are just as likely to rattle the vehicle apart and I'll be . anyway.

Squidly wrote:

Can I come too I don't take up too much room. Sounds like a awesome trip.

I might have a vacancy in the glove box opening up; I'll keep you posted. The Finger

(seriously, if you're not an axe murder some company on the trip would be tops).

*Checks size*
Sorry no can do on the fitting for the glove box not that small.

Not a axe murderer that would take too much energy.

Just looking for new experiences and new adventures.

Joined: 11 Jan 2004 Location: Adelaide

I wouldn't be concerned about the Simpson in September. Crikey, it's only one month out of winter - do people really think the Simpson has only a 3 month "season"?

I would be a little concerned about travelling solo in an unknown vehicle. In terms of risk, unless you do something stupid (like stray from the main routes) you won't go a day without seeing somebody (in September), so help won't be far away - it's just a matter of how much it costs to get you out of the hole you're in. Leave your itinerary with somebody responsible, call them when you leave Birdsville, and again when you hit Dalhousie - worst case, three days before somebody's looking for you.

East to West is supposedly harder, due to prevailing winds making the eastern side of each dune steeper.

Fuel would be an issue, I'm not sure how economical the Delica would be, so I'd want to take at least 100 litres minimum. That should get you to Dalhousie, where you could open your chequebook to buy more help if required.

Take Squidly and go!

Joined: 20 Sep 2004 Location: the vegas

Cheers for that Scott. Cool

I figured there'd be a fair few people out there, not sure if any of them would want to tow a Delica to Alice for me though Confused

As for fuel, it's a 2.4ish TD so it shouldn't be tooooo bad. A few extra jerries and some water and she'll be sweet. Very Happy

Vehicle is at the mechanics atm getting a look over. Hopefully she gets the all clear and I'll get a spares kit together and hit the road.

Joined: 14 Jan 2007 Location: Melbourne

-Scott- wrote:

I wouldn't be concerned about the Simpson in September. Crikey, it's only one month out of winter - do people really think the Simpson has only a 3 month "season"?

Yes it can get to 40+ in September and it does.

-Scott- wrote:

East to West is supposedly harder, due to prevailing winds making the eastern side of each dune steeper.

Correct and the dunes get harder as the weather warms up as they get more powdery as the moisture in them evaporates.

-Scott- wrote:

Fuel would be an issue, I'm not sure how economical the Delica would be, so I'd want to take at least 100 litres minimum. That should get you to Dalhousie, where you could open your chequebook to buy more help if required.

Desert Parks reccommend 160 litres for a diesel and 200 or 220 litres for a petrol. Heading west first fuel is Mt Dare (not Dalhousie). I have done it both ways and pretty much every line across. I prefer going west to east because after spending six nights in the donga without a shower or dunny, its nice to get to Birdsville and stay in one of the motel units out the back of the pub so you can have a little civilisation when you have finished your crossing.

The food at Birdsville has also improved no end and you can even get fresh bread and a real coffee at the bakery there now!

Have you thought about what comms you are going to take with you incase the unforseen occurs? As Slim Dusty once called it "The land of no second chance".

Joined: 20 Sep 2004 Location: the vegas

T_Diesel wrote:

Desert Parks reccommend 160 litres for a diesel and 200 or 220 litres for a petrol. Heading west first fuel is Mt Dare (not Dalhousie). I have done it both ways and pretty much every line across. I prefer going west to east because after spending six nights in the donga without a shower or dunny, its nice to get to Birdsville and stay in one of the motel units out the back of the pub so you can have a little civilisation when you have finished your crossing.

The food at Birdsville has also improved no end and you can even get fresh bread and a real coffee at the bakery there now!

Have you thought about what comms you are going to take with you incase the unforseen occurs? As Slim Dusty once called it "The land of no second chance".

Cheers for the info mate. It seems Iridium phones are relatively easy to rent for a week or so and surprisingly cheap (I saw one place saying $40/wk - too good to be true?). I might be able to get hold of an EPIRB as well.

Joined: 14 Jan 2007 Location: Melbourne

benno_from_brizvegas wrote:

Cheers for the info mate. It seems Iridium phones are relatively easy to rent for a week or so and surprisingly cheap (I saw one place saying $40/wk - too good to be true?). I might be able to get hold of an EPIRB as well.

$40 per week sounds a bit light on. One of the guys I was up there with last week paid $180 for the two weeks to hire one and then calls on top of that which are $3 yes three dollars per thirty seconds.

IMHO HF and VKS 737 is better suited for desert travellers than Sat phones. We were in the middle of the Simpson and just happened to be listening to the Charters Towers broadcast at the same time we heard a mate on the cape up near Weipa relay a message. We changed channels and had a conversation with him over HF from the Simmo to Weipa! It was fantastic and crystal clear.

Joined: 27 Nov 2002 Location: Lost in Melbourne.

benno_from_brizvegas wrote:

T_Diesel wrote:

Desert Parks reccommend 160 litres for a diesel and 200 or 220 litres for a petrol. Heading west first fuel is Mt Dare (not Dalhousie). I have done it both ways and pretty much every line across. I prefer going west to east because after spending six nights in the donga without a shower or dunny, its nice to get to Birdsville and stay in one of the motel units out the back of the pub so you can have a little civilisation when you have finished your crossing.

The food at Birdsville has also improved no end and you can even get fresh bread and a real coffee at the bakery there now!

Have you thought about what comms you are going to take with you incase the unforseen occurs? As Slim Dusty once called it "The land of no second chance".

Cheers for the info mate. It seems Iridium phones are relatively easy to rent for a week or so and surprisingly cheap (I saw one place saying $40/wk - too good to be true?). I might be able to get hold of an EPIRB as well.

Hiring a HF is a good idea. you get so much more, like weather updates, track conditions from other travellers etc.

Joined: 14 Jan 2007 Location: Melbourne

There is a pretty good summary of comms at this web address which outlines the features and benefits or each medium.

http://www.vks737.on.net/pdfs/DOC%2006.pdf

Joined: 11 Jan 2004 Location: Adelaide

T_Diesel wrote:

-Scott- wrote:

I wouldn't be concerned about the Simpson in September. Crikey, it's only one month out of winter - do people really think the Simpson has only a 3 month "season"?

Yes it can get to 40+ in September and it does.

Yes, it can get to 40 degrees. That doesn't mean it will. And so what if it does? It's not the end of the world. Yes, risks increase with the temperature, that's why you plan. With proper planning a whole lot needs to go wrong before a situation becomes truly dangerous. The desert won't be deserted in September - if you stick to the major routes, help won't be far away. Have several days of spare food and water, and spare time in case things go wrong.

T_Diesel wrote:

Desert Parks reccommend 160 litres for a diesel and 200 or 220 litres for a petrol. Heading west first fuel is Mt Dare (not Dalhousie).

Which is why I said "buy help" - not "buy fuel". I used the payphone at Dalhousie when I was there (from memory, only worked with a phone card - I don't think I was able to use coins.)

Yes, Desert Parks may recommend 160 litres for a diesel - like an automatic 100 series. When I went Mt Dare to Birdsville a diesel 4by used 65 litres, I used 95 litres of petrol. With 100 litres on board I would expect a Delica to make it at least to Dalhousie, where I believe the worst of the dangers become negligible.

If you're buying remote area communications, definitely go HF - if you're hiring it for emergencies for one trip, go an Iridium Satphone (NOT Globalstar). A satphone requires less "setup" than a HF radio, and is a lot easier to use, which is important in an emergency; "changing channels" on the HF sounds easy when you know what you're doing, but knowing which frequency to use at which time of day to reach which base requires a little bit of knowledge and experience. For an emergency, I'd recommend an inexperienced user take the Iridium satphone. (Let me say again - Iridium satphone.)

Joined: 14 Jan 2007 Location: Melbourne

-Scott- wrote:

Which is why I said "buy help" - not "buy fuel". I used the payphone at Dalhousie when I was there (from memory, only worked with a phone card - I don't think I was able to use coins.)

Yes, Desert Parks may recommend 160 litres for a diesel - like an automatic 100 series. When I went Mt Dare to Birdsville a diesel 4by used 65 litres, I used 95 litres of petrol. With 100 litres on board I would expect a Delica to make it at least to Dalhousie, where I believe the worst of the dangers become negligible.

The payphone at Dalhousie is not much use to you if you are stranded in the middle of the desert.

There are a number of different ways to cross the Simpson which will determine how much fuel you should take. If you take the French Line the entire way of course you are going to consume less fuel. You also need to take into consideration that as the dunes get more powdery in the warmer weather you are going to consume more fuel getting over them.

I tanked up in Oodndatta and went through about 140 litres of diesel in a Patrol from Oodnadatta to Birdsville. Our crossing was about 800 kms between fuel stops as we dropped down onto the Rig Road and also did a 160 km diversion up to one of Kidman's stations ruins "Annandale" on David Brook's Adria Downs Property.

I would rather take more fuel than I need and finish the crossing with a spare 40 litres rather than worrying about if I am going to make it or not for the last 200kms. As with any remote area travel preparation and planning are paramount to enjoying your time out in the donga.

Joined: 20 Sep 2004 Location: the vegas

Thanks for the advice guys.

Apparently, I can hire a Iridium or Telstra Satellite phone in Birdsville and return it to Mt Dare. About $140ish or so. And get a cold beer and fuel while I'm there Cool

Re HFs, yeah they can be good but Scott has a very good point about ease of use. I've only used them on boats, and TBH I would rather have a sat phone for emergency comms.

Any suggestions on which route? I'm thinking WAA line purely because there's likely to be less people on it than the French line (I find it a bit sad that it's so hard to find somewhere truly remote these days).

I think a full tank of diesel plus 80L in jerries, plus about 60l of water will do me.

Joined: 11 Jan 2004 Location: Adelaide

benno_from_brizvegas wrote:

Any suggestions on which route? I'm thinking WAA line purely because there's likely to be less people on it than the French line (I find it a bit sad that it's so hard to find somewhere truly remote these days).

We did the WAA line 2 years ago. Softer sand than the rig road, really noticed the fuel gauge dropping faster than it had been until then. I would happily do it again.

benno_from_brizvegas wrote:

I think a full tank of diesel plus 80L in jerries, plus about 60l of water will do me.

I think it would...

Joined: 14 Jan 2007 Location: Melbourne

-Scott- wrote:

We did the WAA line 2 years ago. Softer sand than the rig road, really noticed the fuel gauge dropping faster than it had been until then. I would happily do it again.

We did a bit on each line last week. WAA Line is much softer and agree with the fuel dissapearing faster. If you want to find somewhere remote, try out around Gary Junction and Warburton. A couple of years back, we went 8 days without seeing another vehicle. If you want my Oziexplorer plot and track files send me a PM and you can see the route we took. Best map of the area is the Hema map plus you get some great info in your desert parks pass kit now aswell.

benno_from_brizvegas wrote:

I think a full tank of diesel plus 80L in jerries, plus about 60l of water will do me.

Plenty, don't forget a few slabs of beer either it can get hot out there Rolling Eyes

Joined: 20 Sep 2004 Location: the vegas

Permits arrived in the mail yesterday, it's awwwn!

Anyone want to come for a drive? If the desert doesn't kill me the cost of diesel will...

Squidly where'd you go???

Joined: 14 Jan 2007 Location: Melbourne

benno_from_brizvegas wrote:

Anyone want to come for a drive? If the desert doesn't kill me the cost of diesel will...

The price of diesel wasn't that bad a month ago. It was around $2.00 at Oodnadatta and Mt Dare, and Birdsville was $1.82 at the Servo opposite the pub and the servo with the store in it was 12 cents more at 1.94.

The parks kit is pretty good these days, you get some good information and maps etc with it.

Joined: 20 Sep 2004 Location: the vegas

Trip went well, the desert was just awesome - I love it out there.

All went well with the Delica, other than blowing both front shocks on the corrugations afterwards. I think a tie rod end is knackered as well, I'll have to get it looked at.

The driving was pretty easy really, although it becomes a bit more challenging in a loaded Delica with pretty average ground clearance. I talked to an old bloke who had to get winched out a few times - don't know how you get that bogged going up a sand dune. Another bloke nearly rolled his cruiser at Big Red, some other clown got lost on Poeppel lake and I had to get my snatch strap out before I even got to Birdsville - to snatch a guy out of his own driveway! He had a 2wd Falcon ute and the rain turned his driveway into a mud pit.

I used about 110 L or so of diesel doing the Knolls track, WAA line and a small part of the Rig Road.

Joined: 15 Nov 2002 Location: Driving my GU in Melbourne

cool glad you had a great trip. So cough up with the pics now

Joined: 20 Sep 2004 Location: the vegas

grimbo wrote:

cool glad you had a great trip. So cough up with the pics now

Mate I shoot film, so it'll take some time to get the pics developed - I'll get one roll processed here but the rest will be done in Brissy as I don't really trust em here. Very Happy

Joined: 14 Jan 2007 Location: Melbourne

Which line did you end up taking?

Joined: 20 Sep 2004 Location: the vegas

mate I took the WAA line.

Here's a few pics:
http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=58302&id=635826231&ref=mf

More to come when I get the rest of the film developed and scanned.

Joined: 04 Jan 2004 Location: Sunshine Coast

Funny that no one has mentioned the flies in September Laughing

Joined: 04 Apr 2008 Location: West Victoria

How bout puttin the pics somewhere where we don't have to set up an account.

No way in hell I joinin that fark'n facebook.