Raised suspension - is there much point?

Joined: 28 Jan 2004

I know its the done thing to raise your fourby, but I am trying to understand all the pros and cons.

Recent weekend I got stuck in some deep ruts. Rear diff bottomed out. Front wheel lacking traction. All in all, no go. Ended up putting dead branches in the ruts to build it up and continue on.

Raising the suspension would not have helped the diff bottoming out. It also wouldn't have helped the front wheel not grounding.

Given all this, I see that 2 inches higher would give me more front end clearance, but not at the rear - ie, diff is still the limiting factor. I suppose if I team the raise with longer travel shocks and bump stop shortening, I could get more droop in the front.

Cons that I see are higher car, therefore more propensity to tip over when leaning. Does anyone worry about tipping over? Lordy knows I do - whether or not it is warranted. I could swear a couple of times I was going over!

Lastly, being that my shocks are in ok condition, what would happen if I did a 2" lift with standard shocks? I suppose I would end up with very little suspension droop to fall into ruts....

Thanks
LJ
Pajero NL 3.5L SOHC

Joined: 14 Jan 2003 Location: Kansas City, USA

Point of the lift is to be able to put bigger tires on then you get clearance increased all around

Joined: 03 Jan 2003 Location: USA

Alex Kogan wrote:

Point of the lift is to be able to put bigger tires on then you get clearance increased all around

Also, most obstacles are not in the form of ruts. By placing your tires on top of the obstacle you lift the diff over obstructions. The suspension lift raises the rest of parts: the frame, the drive train; so you dont get high centered in the process of placing you tires on the obstacle.

Joined: 24 Oct 2002 Location: Brisbane, Nthsider

the lift also allows you to put longer shocks in to suit the longer springs which gives you more travel to drop wheels into ruts and to climb over rocks which makes the car more stable off road and reducing the chance of a roll over(off road).

mike.

Joined: 25 Sep 2003 Location: "Shit"ney

Also reduces the amount of "arrse drag" when going down drop offs or deep ruts - check the condition of your petrol tank after a few good 4be trips 'cause you will probably be carrying less petrol than factory specs tell you.

Ramp over height is a big bonus.

Joined: 28 Jan 2004

Yes, good point, ramp over. Hadn't given that much thought. Yeah, I have a Long Ranger and it now has two decent bends in it. One from the previous owner and one from me :(

So no one gets concerned about the higher centre of gravity then, ie more rollover prone? I was swaying in a rut a while back when the opposite wheels were in holes, on a good lean, and I could have sworn I was a gonner! but it didn't.....

Ok, but if I put a set of coil in the rear, bump up the front bars, with standard shocks. Will I be worse off, or still better. What I suppose I am saying, is do the standard shock have more travel in them beyond the standard bump stop point, so that if I cut them down a little, the shock will be able to extend to there, or is the shock maxxed at the standard bump point?

ta
LJ

Joined: 17 Nov 2003 Location: Brisbane

Yes there is more travel in the factory ones, when I first raised mine 2" I kept the standard shocks for a while. After cutting the bump stops the shocks extended to allow full droop at the front, and I did not notice any restriction at the rear but I did not measure it there. The new shocks now appear to give more travel at the rear but again not measured.

I love the extra height especially for the clearance under the front bash plates and at the back bumper and fuel tank (also long range). Of course the 285's give me extra clearance over the standard tyres as well.

I don't think the lift has affected the roll over angle much for practical purposes, I know the feeling of teetering on two wheels Crying or Very sad

and it is a much greater angle than you might imagine.

Joined: 26 Jul 2003 Location: Brisney Land

JMeager wrote:

I was swaying in a rut a while back when the opposite wheels were in holes, on a good lean, and I could have sworn I was a gonner! but it didn't.....

It's an IFS thing you get used to when having a Pajero Very Happy

. It helps learning the limitations and learning to drive around the 'challenges' the vehicle poses.
One of the main things i see with lift, is getting the door sills out of the way grrr.

Joined: 28 Jan 2004

Yeah, I mashed one of my side steps on that same trip. Dropped off a big dip, and coming over it there was a rock to the side which clipped it, bending it upwards....it cought the alli top. A lot of bashing later, and it is flat again - munted but flat....

Alright. I'm convinced now. Thanks guys.

Now, here we go. I'm in Western Australia. I am concerned that I have read about many OME shock failures. I want to buy the springs that will match the shock I decide to go with.

And I also cannot work out whether you want a harder shock or softer than factory. I totally understand suspension for car racing, but for 4wding, I'm not sure.
I know that you want harder shocks to for high speed dirt road handling. I guess you want soft for crawling over obstacles....

advise again please.

Oh, and thanks very much guys. I appreciate you taking your time to answer me!

LJ

Joined: 17 Nov 2003 Location: Brisbane

I think hard and soft are relative terms, it depends what you start with.

The original shocks on my NK were very hard on compression giving a slightly bouncy ride, but pretty good bitumen handling. I replaced them with TJM XGS shocks which were softer on compression but probably stiffer on rebound. This resulted in a much better ride and also better handling due to less bounce over rough surfaces.

In my opinion too hard a shock can make the ride very harsh (experience with an earlier leaf sprung Paj and very hard shocks, no fade but loose fillings) whereas soft compression and a well controlled rebound gives good handling and ride on and off road.

I guess brands are a personal thing, closely linked to finances, so look at what is available and talk to anybody except the guys selling the products. Their own brand is always the best.

Good luck.

Joined: 26 Oct 2002 Location: Melbourne

I think one of the most important things on a Pajero (and most other IFS rigs) is to get the front bashplate as high as possible off the deck.
That will be the first thing that stops your progress and will yield much more clearance than a live axle vehicle with the same size tyres.
Also a 3.5 V6 has a 10" rear pumpkin a 3.0 V6 has a 9" so you will need 32"s on the 3.5 to match or slightly better the clearance of a 3.0 running 31"s.

Frank.

Joined: 05 Jan 2004 Location: Campbelltown, Sydney

JMeager wrote:

I know that you want harder shocks to for high speed dirt road handling.

Don't go too hard! I used to race speedway and tried a pretty stiff setup. I hit a rut in the track and the rolling commenced. Net result of the stiff gear was to act like a pogo stick.

Joined: 03 Jan 2003 Location: USA

[quote="Nev62"]

JMeager wrote:

I know that you want harder shocks to for high speed dirt road handling.

Wouldnt you be better off with some stiffer sway bars, and shocks that are soft enough to soak up the whoops??

Joined: 28 Jan 2004

Quote:

Wouldnt you be better off with some stiffer sway bars, and shocks that are soft enough to soak up the whoops??

Hahaha, and then you have no articulation. You can't win can you! Doesn't matter which way you go, you lose out.
LJ

My Rig · Joined: 08 Mar 2004 Location: North Rocks

Didn't have side steps installed as I have seen them bent on other vehicles. Just installed a Long Ranger which is higher than the tow bar that normally gets the hits. Heard OME are subject to fade but not failure?

Joined: 28 Jan 2004

Quote:

Heard OME are subject to fade but not failure?

Can't see the point of replacing factory shocks for shocks that are no better! I have used Koni and Bilstein in my race cars and always found them to be excellent shocks. However in racing you are not working a shock hard, but you are after good bump and rebound. With 4wding you are after a shock that requires good anti-fade as you work them much harder, more stroke movement etc.....

I have bought some king spring 40mm higher with progressive rate rears. These I hope will give me the extra lift, extra load carrying when needed via the progressive rate, but not make it a hard ride normally. As the car is only loaded up for trips, the rest of the time it is nearly factory weight in the rear as I don't have draws etc.

Can someone tell me the specs of the bolts I need for the front for the suspension for the re-shimming of the sus as the guy told be my bolts were too short for any more movement last time I was there!
that way I can buy them and have them ready for when I take it in there for re-alignment.....

thanks!

Jeff